These basics of monothesitic religion are self-evident

[sgttomas]

I think it is inevitable that human minds will conceive of this:

- There is one God, who created all things and is present in and throughout the universe and this is worthy of worship

- There is a tension between life and death - order and chaos - meaning and void that will be resolved with life/order/meaning prevailing (or perhaps that the tension will never end....i suppose it hinges on the conception of time).

- Righteousness is worthy of our devotion and fullest effort, but cannot be completely understood

- The soul survives death, will be judged, and will be reunited with God (it isn't as obvious, to me, that one must also inherit a body of sorts, but perhaps the notion of a unique personal entity can be a more abstract way of saying "body"). It may also be true that some souls do not survive.

These truths will be self-evident.

Pagan religions may be the most self-evidently true in a different state of mind.

From this proto theology we construct our mythologies and religions. Therefore religions are both exclusive and yet share the same undercarriage like a Mazda 6 (reference to Zoroastrianism not intended) and a Ford Focus. Our religions are embellishments and a matter of personal taste (one might prefer the Focus) or cultural necessity (why should it be a car and not a horse and carriage?).

Therefore we all worship the same God if we worship the one true God (see above), regardless of how our religions have dispersed us along different paths to the same end.

It is not possible to logically deny this by reference to a particular theology. We may imagine that my last statement is not possibly true, but this is due to a missed circular reference to a particular theology.

- - - - - - - -

^That....far as I can tell....is what my religious beliefs are.

Now I need to get onto deciding what kind of car I'm going to drive....maybe it won't even be a car! ....I hope I do this quickly, because that's when I can really start to get some answers about that righteousness stuff, and how seriously I should be taking it.

Peace,
-sgttomas

[Metacrock]

good post Tom. yes I agree. Also the idea of one God is basically kosher with Occam's razor, and polytheism is challenged by the razor. But that's another story.

the real arguments come in where we start trying to attach cultural constructs, argue about which set of constructs is 'right.'

read Why God wont Go away, by Newberg. he has some great info derived from theories of brain perception as to why this must be so. It's a ground breaking book. there is a dynamite argument for God there, but it has to be teased out.

[sgttomas]

the real arguments come in where we start trying to attach cultural constructs, argue about which set of constructs is 'right.'

So true.

read Why God wont Go away, by Newberg. he has some great info derived from theories of brain perception as to why this must be so. It's a ground breaking book. there is a dynamite argument for God there, but it has to be teased out.

Oooh! Sounds very interesting!!! ...I'm excited to check it out, THANKS =)

Peace,
-sgttomas

[sgttomas]

bought the book....but when I did, I saw this one too and I just couldn't resist! I started it first. Devoured half of it last night. Awesome.

-sgtt.

[Metacrock]

bought the book....but when I did, I saw this one too and I just couldn't resist! I started it first. Devoured half of it last night. Awesome.

-sgtt.

wow! great find. Now I have to go get it.

[sgttomas]

Almost 2 years later and having "selected my car" (see below), how does this "self-evident" theory look to me? This took place 3 months prior to me declaring my faith in Islam. It was also before "first contact" with my Muslim buddy, so this was pretty much what I believed right at the point before being introduced to Islam. It isn't very surprising in hindsight why it was all so easy to believe in. I remember being astonished that this religion appeared so well matched to what I believed. And that appears to have been a valid assessment, as nothing has changed to require me to modify any of my "self-evident" beliefs!

I think it is inevitable that human minds will conceive of this:

- There is one God, who created all things and is present in and throughout the universe and this is worthy of worship

I mean...in so far as one can describe God - a monotheistic god - I guess this is okay.

- There is a tension between life and death - order and chaos - meaning and void that will be resolved with life/order/meaning prevailing (or perhaps that the tension will never end....i suppose it hinges on the conception of time).

This was a nascent thought in terms of the necessity of being. I have since integrated this question into the notion of the "ground of being", as it is called around these parts

Since this is absolutely fundamental to any explanation of reality, I'd say that I'm happy the first two parts of my self-evident religion are: The One and The Self-Subsistent Fount of Being. Top marks!

- Righteousness is worthy of our devotion and fullest effort, but cannot be completely understood

Sure. This was essentially what I was saying.

- The soul survives death, will be judged, and will be reunited with God (it isn't as obvious, to me, that one must also inherit a body of sorts, but perhaps the notion of a unique personal entity can be a more abstract way of saying "body"). It may also be true that some souls do not survive.

Yeah, I essentially believe something like this...again, in this case the metaphor/imagery is totally in sufficient to really portray the "afterlife", but...yeah I'm pretty good with this too.

These truths will be self-evident.

Yeah, that's still basically how I feel. Even though I've undergone a tremendous amount of reorientation in terms of the righteousness part, I still feel in my self that I have been following what is self-evidently true about reality. With the firm knowledge that humility is of incredible importance so as to avoid the fundamental attribution error.

Pagan religions may be the most self-evidently true in a different state of mind.

Of course, this comes from attributing much to God that is false.

From this proto theology we construct our mythologies and religions. Therefore religions are both exclusive and yet share the same undercarriage like a Mazda 6 (reference to Zoroastrianism not intended) and a Ford Focus. Our religions are embellishments and a matter of personal taste (one might prefer the Focus) or cultural necessity (why should it be a car and not a horse and carriage?).

Therefore we all worship the same God if we worship the one true God (see above), regardless of how our religions have dispersed us along different paths to the same end.

It is not possible to logically deny this by reference to a particular theology. We may imagine that my last statement is not possibly true, but this is due to a missed circular reference to a particular theology.

Wow, now this really surprised me when I read it through again. Because I was not very lenient here. And yet I can still say I hold this to be absolutely necessarily true. Of course there is still a great deal of space to imagine alternative car models, so in terms of choice and freedom there is plenty - but the framework of truth is as I have set forth here. The only thing that is undefined is a criteria for determining which is the BEST car model, or the greatest truth. Of course as it becomes "better", or more "supreme" it must still retain the properties I've described here. ...I still like my position here, too, though it is constantly evolving it is always in terms of higher, more integrated design, rather than random evolution.

- - - - - - - -

^That....far as I can tell....is what my religious beliefs are.

That, as far as I can tell, is still what my religious beliefs are.

Now I need to get onto deciding what kind of car I'm going to drive....maybe it won't even be a car! ....I hope I do this quickly, because that's when I can really start to get some answers about that righteousness stuff, and how seriously I should be taking it.

Peace,
-sgttomas

Peace,
-sgttomas

[sgttomas]

Also both of those books were incredibly cool and totally in line with the beliefs I expressed in this post.

-sgtt

[met]

Seems to me like most polytheistic beliefs, that i know of at least, admit to a single 'force' behind the multitude of manifestations ... eg the Hindu Brahman. Where do the differences lie? In how directly 'knowable' that force could be? ... yeah, that could be it! ... but, i don't wanna speak too rashly. Turns out it's very complicated, this cross-religious-tradition stuff