Head-->Wall Quote of the Week

[tinythinker]

"I’ll be danged if I am going to give up my Social Security because of socialism."

[sgttomas]

lol.

I'm in Ontario right now, visited Niagra-on-the-lake yesterday. There was an American gal (from Michigan) engaging a shopkeeper in conversation and it turned to medicare (Canadian healthcare) and the American gal objected because she doesn't want "socialized healthcare"....no further explaination required, apparently. Heh, it was fun to watch from a distance.

Peace,
-sgttomas

[QuantumTroll]

The right-wing American view on health-care is one of the things I'm often asked about here in Sweden. It's completely alien and incomprehensible to most Swedes. It boils down to the belief (or lack thereof) that every person has an equal right to life and that the government's role is to protect people's rights...

Still haven't heard a good reply to that from an anti-nationalized health-care person

[tinythinker]

The right-wing American view on health-care is one of the things I'm often asked about here in Sweden. It's completely alien and incomprehensible to most Swedes. It boils down to the belief (or lack thereof) that every person has an equal right to life and that the government's role is to protect people's rights...

Still haven't heard a good reply to that from an anti-nationalized health-care person

As you know, during the Cold War the new "enemy" in America were the Communists. The fact that what was being practiced in places like the USSR, The Peoples Republic of China, North Korea, Myanmar, etc were corrupted/failed visions of what Communism was intended to offer was beside the point. And since these states often had "socialist" in their titles or propaganda, anything associated with Marx (no one here remembers Engels) was "bad", "evil", "un-American", "dangerous", etc. And being of the enemy, our own propaganda over-simplified and demonized everything that had to do with socialism, equating it completely with its harshest incarnations - government seizing successful businesses and their profits, government dictating your career, government dictating where you live, etc, etc. In other words, the end of personal freedom and choice. And along with our own myth that Capitalism is God's gift to humanity (see about our Puritan heritage) and it is what makes us so successful (it is virtually conflated with "freedom", as in "free markets"). And that's it. Any deeper sophistication or knowledge of history is frequently lacking. And worse, those educated conservatives who should know better give credence to such views (much like the educated YECs).

So, you get lots of sadly inane and idiotic non-sequitors like the one I quoted. People who won't give up basics like publicly paved roads/transit systems, etc, but who demonize any new public national publicly run initiatives as "socialized" X, Y, and Z. They never call the programs they like or that too many of their own based like "socialized", though. It is code for "government take-over". They deride the welfare programs for the poor and injured, but they don't call tax-breaks and payouts to companies "corporate welfare". A strain of conservatism that began in the 1960s, was given a prominent face by Reagan in the 1980s, fueled the "Republican revolution" (takeover over Congress in the 1990s), and enabled the Bush administration in this decade, says that government is always the problem, not the solution. Privatization is always best. The free market will correct all problems. De-regulation and the slashing of social programs is essential. The emphasis should be on helping/defending corporations over helping individuals or as a superior way of helping individuals, as it is the wealthy and powerful who "provide" for the rest.

So let's turn to healthcare. When Medicare was proposed, the exact same scare tactics were used then that are being used today (check out this brilliant analysis by Reagan in 1961), about government takeover and loss of freedom. Now, even though some hardcore ideologues do say Medicare/Social Security are "bad", the Republicans won't dare try to take them down. Too many of their voters and voter's parents need it! But they do keep trying to "privatize" the programs (Bush wanted to make invest the fund in the stock market - that would have ended so well). And unfortunately so many conservative voters are ignorant of too much about the issues and lied to so often with slick spin campaigns they can't see the inconsistencies. They don't want "socialized" medicine but they don't want to lose Medicare. They claim competition in the market place is always good and improves products and services but they don't want private insurers to compete with any kind of "public option". They claim the government is so bad it can't do anything right but they are worried it will become too popular. And on and on. Then you get the really bizarre stuff like the quote up top, which shows total confusion on the issue.

[tinythinker]

(And yes there are plenty if ignorant liberals who also don't grasp the historical and philosophical underpinnings of their principles either, similarly reducing them to soundbyte style expressions of policy.)

[Metacrock]

did you read my blog for sunday/monday? I have compared the right wing's take on health care to the movie Dr. Srangelove.

[LACanuck]

Now my favorite quote from the Healthcare debate has been "Keep your government hands off my medicare".

That one is in the lead over Frank's "Having a discussion with you is like arguing with a dining room table".

I just love substantive, intellectual debates.

[QuantumTroll]

Hehe, Dr. Strangelove. Nice way of looking at things, Meta . What doesn't that movie apply to? At its core lies a well-told tale of human folly — one of our civilization's universal themes!

Hmm, I've always thought of Dr. Strangelove (and the nuclear bomb itself) as another Faust story. Who is the devil responsible for American-style healthcare? $$$?

[KR Wordgazer]

The "devils" in the US healthcare system are unrestrained greed and lack of compassion. And a system set up to reward both.