Hi Meta I'm back. I wonder why most people are against CPR.

Discuss arguments for existence of God and faith in general. Any aspect of any orientation toward religion/spirituality, as long as it is based upon a positive open to other people attitude.

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GarrettQ
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Hi Meta I'm back. I wonder why most people are against CPR.

Post by GarrettQ » Thu Feb 21, 2008 5:41 pm

Does this puzzle you too? I wonder why they would consider that playing God. When it does not harm anyone else, what would make it wrong or against God to want to be resuscitated? What diseases are okay to cure, and what diseases should be left uncured?

Garrett

I believe people live on a false dichotomy that they are either afraid of death or against medical treatment.

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Metacrock
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Re: Hi Meta I'm back. I wonder why most people are against CPR.

Post by Metacrock » Thu Feb 21, 2008 10:25 pm

hey Garrett good to see you again man! glad you caught up with us. found where we are.

I didn't know all that many people are against cpr.
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GarrettQ
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Technically it's true that most people are not...

Post by GarrettQ » Sat Feb 23, 2008 1:02 pm

and now we have a way to revive people after an hour of clinical death with little or no brain damage. And for mammals (in what I thought was a sad experiment) some cats were kept clinical dead and had all brain activity stopped for seven years and then were revived. An elderly woman had been 'dead' for much shorter a time and had been OK with having the same (but improved) technique used on her. But shockingly some people challenged the procedure in court. luckily the woman's defendants succeeded at protecting her right to life largely by presenting the example of the cat experiment as evidence. In British Columbia and Germany, this procedure is illegal so anybody dying in these areas would need to be rushed elsewhere to be saved. so technically people are okay with CPR but if it or any improvement is needed they strangely get weirded out when someone lives who for whatever other reason should in their opinion be dead, and and leave and passed laws go to court or otherwise go out of her way to make sure that someone stays dead.

ZAROVE
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Re: Hi Meta I'm back. I wonder why most people are against CPR.

Post by ZAROVE » Sat Feb 23, 2008 3:07 pm

I don't really know what your talkign about, Garret. The majority of people, of nay religion, seem to support Recesutaiton.

GarrettQ
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Good, because this is one thing I'd love to be

Post by GarrettQ » Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:52 am

wrong about. Now the only question is why so few include the latest recessitation in their ambulance/health insurance. Most people can afford it, so it may just be that they don't know about it. For those interested, I could help them learn more and even to make arrangements.

Garrett

PS I was referring to people in general; My father is an atheist and prefers to avoid this recessitation since he finds comfort in the idea that someday he'll be dead for the rest of eternity. Perhaps surprising he's not suicidal, he finds meaning in relationships, stays active with volunteer work and is liked or loved by most everyone who knows him.

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Metacrock
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Re: Hi Meta I'm back. I wonder why most people are against CPR.

Post by Metacrock » Sun Feb 24, 2008 1:18 pm

I dont' get it. a lot of people cant' afford health insurrance. it's a growing problem. I've never heard anyone say they don' t want cpr if it is needed.
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runamokmonk
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Re: Hi Meta I'm back. I wonder why most people are against CPR.

Post by runamokmonk » Sun Feb 24, 2008 2:56 pm

You sure you don't mean a lot of people don't want to be put on life support?

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Metacrock
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Re: Hi Meta I'm back. I wonder why most people are against CPR.

Post by Metacrock » Sun Feb 24, 2008 7:06 pm

good point. I thought he meant like they are against first aid or something.
Have Theology, Will argue: wire Metacrock
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GarrettQ
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To answer both of you,

Post by GarrettQ » Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:07 am

I am referring to cryogenic suspension. Some people claim that it's playing God trying to preserve dead people and bring dead people back to life. But even if there were something wrong with that , no such thing is being attempted here; The people are only legally dead, but the process of dying actually continues at least many hours after that stage of 'death'. In fact if you choke on something your brain won't really die in just ten minutes-that takes an additional 24 hours- ironically it has been our now out dated methods of reviving people that causes a person who's without oxygen for ten minutes to end up permanently brain dead(note brain dead merely means no brain activity). The latest techniques work to stop cell death by preventing swelling which previously kept a brain from getting oxygen even after the person's heart was restarted.

I think some people are just afraid of an alien future. I think that is an unlikely worst case scenario. Those with friends or family may likely find many of them still around, and if so even in youthful health. Those who think the kids of today can only expect to live 70-90 years are simply not paying any attention to fast technology is progressing. Legally and ethically it must be pointed out that we are waiting on some technology, but also reasonably it is not fantasy pie in the sky. We already have successfully cryogenically preserved and revived fully functional organs such as kidneys and intestines. We also have the ability to create true stem cells from ordinary cells and grow clones without brains. It is mainstream science that we have nanotech that can cure cancer in the process of getting FDA approval, and mainstream science that some unfortunate cat brains were cryogenically preserved for seven years and revived.

As for cost, many give new meaning to life insurance by using that. The only additional ongoing cost is a monthly of annual due. Per year it's $55 for college students and about $360 at most per year otherwise for the first family member. But after that the most it cost is half off for each additional family member. My other health insurance is very substantially more costly. Later that won't be a big deal either, but for now I only make around $15,000 per year.

So was I wrong? Are most actually cool with this? Or if they/you are not going for it, what the main reason:

Is it the price? A philosophy of life/death? Fear of being alive 42 years from now? Unfamiliarity with something new? Or not sure how to go through the process of arrangements? -I've been there, I can and am willing to help others out with that and see that they everything upfront.

Closing poem:

So hopefully prove me wrong,
or show me that as usual I was right all along.

Garrett

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Metacrock
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Re: Hi Meta I'm back. I wonder why most people are against CPR.

Post by Metacrock » Sat Mar 01, 2008 3:08 am

I just think it wont work. sorry for the misunderstanding though. I thought you meant artificial receussitation.

say Garrett what happened to the modal logic? do you not do it now days? no thoughts about God? where are you now? chatch me up: religiously, philosophically, emotionally, physically.
Have Theology, Will argue: wire Metacrock
Buy My book: The Trace of God: Warrant for belief

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